As I write this, the negative/problem posts continue to stack up on <a href="http://www.hdtvmagazine.com/cgi-bin/ntlinktrack.cgi?http://www.dbstalk.com/">DBSTalk.com</a>, a Web forum devoted to satellite TV and its users. Since late summer, that particular forum has been ground zero for a major "debate" of sorts, one that, in essence, separated DIRECTV defenders from detractors (though to be fair, not everyone who posts is firmly on one side or the other).
i couldnt have said it any better. i too have been a directv dub since the 1st toshiba dst3000 came out and ive never seen directv fall on their face so badly. its a real shame.
I have been a C-Band (big dish) user for 12 years and ReplayTV user for 6 years. The time had come last fall to make the switch to a small dish system. Dish or DirecTV? My home theater guru favors DirecTV over Dish but pointed out all of the problems with the current DirecTV HD DVR plus the fact that the HR20 was then on back order. Since an HD DVR was critical to my watching (I NEVER watch anything live except the PBS news hour), I went with Dish. Dish has short comings for sure (they wouldn't give me Golf Channel ala carte -- it only comes in their most expensive package ) But their 622 HD DVR is a great product. And, for me, it has the feature that I don't think that I could live without, the 30-second forward skip and 10-second backward skip. Both my previous ReplayTV units had this. I understand that the HR 20 does not have this feature. So, I am locked in to Dish for 18 months and will look and see where DirecTV is at that time. Dish does not currently have my local network channels in HD, but I get them over-the-air pretty well and Dish should have them this year. So, for the intermediate term anyway, I am convinced that II made the right choice (based on my requirements anyway).
I've been a loyal DirecTv subscriber since its birth, when it was only available in a couple test market cities. Over the years, I've enjoyed the nearly seamless quality of service and diversity of programming.
With DirecTv's implementation of TiVo, I was overjoyed, because my SD TiVos performed flawlessly. They have NEVER suffered a single problem, and their elegant user interface easily enticed my wife and young daughter. Even the bean shaped remote was a pleasure to hold.
Now, I have an HR20, and can honestly say I've never experienced a more flawed device in my life. How could such a high profile, respected company, facing ever increasing competition, allow a device like this to ever be sold? Surely they knew it was deeply flawed, and if they didn't know before customers did, that's equally damning.
Never has the bloom of excitement and anticipation of a new high end electronics purchase been so abruptly extinguished by the performance of the product.
After convincing my wife that HDTV was the way to go, she also is now entirely satisfied with the SD recordings of our old TiVos. Anything to avoid the endless glitches of the new recorder. Despite software updates (including the most recent "test" version that hasn't been nationally released yet), the device still is unable to record a show free of continual audio and video dropouts. It's so irritating to watch that even I've returned to the old TiVos to record my favorite shows.
Sure, the HR20 DVR is great when it works (ie, isn't recording anything), but for $299 merely for the right to pay a monthly lease for a device DirecTv owns and eventually wants back (even though it only has a 90 day warranty), and a new 2-year commitment to DirecTv that starts when I turn the HR20 on, I'd say my expectation is that the DVR should work fairly consistently or never be sold to me. I'd like to watch TV, not struggle with a recorder. If this were a VCR or something I owned instead of leased, I'd have literally taken a sledgehammer to it already, splattering its guts all over my garage floor.
Some of the early HR20 adopters seem to enjoy the endless tinkering involved with using this device, posting endlessly flatulant reports to various blogs about successful reboots and nuanced improvements from various software revisions.
But there are many more still who simply will dump DirecTv, as I will, and move to Dish, cable or FIOS.
If ever there was a product that cried out for a class action lawsuit, the HR20 is it. Since the device does not work as specified, I see my new 2-year commitment as void. If DirecTv disagrees, perhaps a massive lawsuit is necessary to convince them.
Complaints to DirecTv customer service fall on deaf ears. "Our unit is just like a TiVo," the voice on the phone cheerfully tells me. "Yeah, and I suppose an MP3 player with audio dropouts is just like an iPod," I reply.
I was a D*TV subscriber almost from day one. But last summer when we got to our cabin in CO I discovered that the old receiver there wasn't working. Since I wanted to switch to HD there anyway, I did a little research and saw that D*TV was having problems with it's new unit. So I decided to go with Dish - LOTS more HD content - ok, so some of it isn't the greatest - and I could get the local Denver channels in HD as well.
I can't say that I like it better - I record some things like Silent Sunday Nights on TCM manually for 2.5 hours and I liked being able to go directly to the end and step my way backwards to find the end of the movie. Can't seem to do that with the Dish recorder. On the other hand, here was a pleasant bonus, when we got back to MN I cancelled D*TV there and added Dish as an additional receiver. To my amazement, I get the Denver locals there as well - no beaming like D*TV - so if my antenna isn't working the greatest I can switch and watch network stuff from CO. Also, many programs are an hour later in CO - sometimes a bonus too. The flip side is that the program guide is in Mountain Standard Time. Gotta remember to add an hour....... :D
I would think that since D*TV has not delivered what they promised, you might consider cancelling and letting them sue you for what they think you owe them for the balance. Turn it into a class action suit and watch the sparks fly. Plaintiffs seldom win much in class actions, but often the defendent at least loses......frequently enough satisfaction for the winners.....
Nice review---i have been following this forum and agree the HR20 is still unofficially in beta testing and you guys are the lab animals----and btw your paying to be experimented on !!!
as for me---i am still using the HR10-250 without hassles om my triple lnb---but like prev experience with microsofts windows------
I plan to upgrade to VISTA and the HR20 january 1 , 2008----maybe !!!
again sorry for your frustrations--i had a minor one with e HR10-250 and HDMI--when it first came out---but luckily the component video worked fine and 2 yrs later thats what i am using
KEEP FIGHTING THOUGH !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Boy ,is your article right on. Eight year customer, just "upgraded to HR20 and kept my HR 10 for another TV. Have experienced it all, video and audio drops, the dreaded blank screen, Have lost pay-per-view recordings which really pissed me off. Have several emails and calls into DirecTV, have rebooted entire drive twice, had to reprogram all our shows. Now what, have 30 days left on my warranty. Is it a hardware or software probrlem? Should I demand anothe receiver? They should have made a deal with TIVO and kept the same manufacturers of the HR10-250.
I've had a few problems but not as many as some. Since I only use this in the home theater to watch a few HD shows each week it's bearable for now, but just barely.
If I was using this to replace my SD DirecTivo upstairs I'd be really pissed.
It's obvious that DirecTV thought they could make DVRs just like Tivo and I think they're in over their head with both hardware and software issues.
They should go crawling back to Tivo and figure out how to get mpeg4 satellite tuners into the series 4 Tivos.
I would join in a lawsuit, I don't see why I should have to pay to debug their crap.
They need to be paying me for the lost shows, the failure to function.
I believe some of these, I have had no problem people are DTV plants.
DishNetwork should pay the initial fee's and get us a good lawyer to come after their ass.
I was a happy A+ customer for many years with 5 receivers. I have a 5 lnb feed antenna and have enjoyed HD for over a year now.
Then a Christmas I decided to get my wife an HR20 for all the shows she likes to see, but misses. The first HR20 I hooked up started up fine then failed going through its initialization. DirecTV sent out a technician to look at the box. He couldn't get it to turn up either. So after a couple of hours of messing around - a lot of it on hold waiting for DirecTV techs to help. DirecTV decided to send another unit out.
Well 4 days later I get a refurbished unit, unfortunately it is an H20, not an HR20. I call of the number on technical support. They make me go through the entire test procedure again ( a good half hour) and of course it still will not initialize. Then I am put on hold for 30 minutes while someone tries to figure out how to send a new box out. Finally I get an agreement that a new box will be shipped. 4 days later I have another H20 show up on my doorstep.
This time I do not go to the technical depart but demand to speak to a manager. After 45 minutes on hold I give up and decided to call the next day. This time I have success after a mere 20 minutes on hold. This person takes me through technical support and customer support process. 45 minutes later (most of it on hold) DirecTV thinks they can get me an HR20. 4 days later here is the HR20. I hook it up and this unit works for about 5 minutes then up pops a "Does not support this mode" message.
Now I have an h10 and an h20 receiver that have absolutely no problem with my tv or cables ( I even tried switching to the DirecTV hdmi cable to see if it was a resistance problem). This product is just not going to work. I have read horror stories of people trading out 3 or 4 units before getting a working one. It's just not worth it.
So I am going from an extremely satisfied A+ customer to one who is going to cancel his service tomorrow. If this is the type of results that DirecTV considers a huge success, then they are really in serious trouble.
I spoke too soon. I've lost 3 recordings the last week. They show recorded but when you play them they immediately stop and ask if you want to keep or delete.
I purchased an HR20S from circuit city a few days ago. This unit was manufactured on 12-15-06. Used the hdmi cable supplied with it. Downloaded the lasted software release, not the beta one and spent two and a half hours with tech support trying to get this thing working with an outside antenna to no success. Tried different zipcodes. The unit would only allow one local out of four that all have strong signals and one of the secondary local channels out of three. And the secondary one is my weakest channel. All of the channels I wanted to receive in both my primary and secondary locals were listed in the guide. Makes no sence what so ever. Very Dissappointed.......Luckily I bought the unit from circuit city and was able to return it and get a refund. So here I sit watching and using the R15 dvr with my nice new hd flatscreen lcd. What a bummer. I can't put into words how dissappointed I am. By the way I knew more about the HR20 than the hd dvr advanced tech support guy. That really sucks.
Tom, very well written article. Thanks for the information. I do have a question though. I currently own the HR 10-250, and have only recently began experiencing problems with signal loss. I just have to unplug it, wait a minute or so, and then power it back up and it works fine. Since I started having these problems, I thought that I should explore upgrading to the new equipment. As a result, I just recently contacted Direct TV and upgraded to the new 5 LNB dish and the new HR 20 DVR for $99. However, after reading all the problems people from around the country are having with this product, would I be better off calling them back, canceling my order, and just waiting for these technical issues to be worked out? Or, should I just take my chances with the new order? I plan on moving my HR 10-250 to another room, and not getting rid of it just in case. I'd like your opinion on this. Thanks in advance for any ideas. Jeff
Bye Bye DirecTv. After spending $110 a month for 5 years because of HD programming I'm going to leave you because you don't have an HDTiVo any more and your new HD DVR(and SD DVR) is lousy. I've already dropped most of my programming and the only reason I still have DirecTV is for the HDNet channels. I gone back to Comcast because they have embraced TiVo instead of shunning it like DirecTV.
HDTV Magazine needs to camp on Direct TV's doorstep until they receive some plausible answers and solutions to these problems. Especially since the TIVO units were a godsend to those of us that still use them error-free. This deniability, secrecy and lying about a product is unbelievable. Who does Direct TV think they are...the Bush administration?
Concerning the problem with the Direct TV DVR
I don't know if they are still in business, but an alternative to
recording and/or archiving with Direct TV in HD is to contact
the 169 Time Company in California. They can provide receivers
which connect via firewire to a JVC D-VHS recorder. This also solves
the problem of being limited to X number of hours of HD tv recording
capability of the DVR. D-VHS recordings done in this manner are
virtually undistinguishable from the live broadcast. The JVC D-VHS
also records excellently local HDTV OTA broadcasts, using a local
antenna. Blank D-VHS tapes are readily available from mail order sources
such as Edgewise Media (on both coasts) and Tape World in Pennsylvania
and cost under $7 for 2
I recently had the HR20 installed and had it freeze up on the second day. I had to unplug it to get it to startup again- now one week later it is still operating correctly, lets hope this will last. I moved my HR10-250 to another room. I also moved the standard Tivo unit. I have had the HR10-250 also freeze and have to unplug to reset but it always comes back but it is frustating. Ralph
I had all the problems mentioned in dbstalk.com , called DirecTv several times plus emails. They had me do a hard boot a couple of times to no avail. Before the 90 days was up, I asked for a replacement which was sent to me with a return FedEx slip. New one works great so far. They also gave me credit for 3 recorded PPV movies I lost in the reboot process.
Great article! Unfortunately, we are dealing with a company that does NOT listen to their customers, don't understand the opportunity they had to lead their HDTV offering into a market leader position, and believe that alpha products is ok to push to market as alpha products.
I for one cannot wait until FIOS is in my neighborhood (only 6 months), because then it is goodbye D*TV! I will be able to continue using the best interface to DVR ever made available = Tivo! and get HD the right way combined with even higher speed internet (compared to what I have today) D*TV's retention department will not have a chance!
My HR20 (almost 2 weeks old) decided to go on the fritz literally two hours before our super bowl party. I would gladly join a classaction lawsuit. And of course, DIRECTV wasn't helpful at all.
If you get that then I want my Idol episodes too from Charter and/or Sony!
My Charter Moxi took a dump erasing all programming skipping the Alabama show and the Feb 20th show.
Fortunately I had it on my Sony so we watched the Alabama show and at the end I erased it only to find the someway, somehow the feb 20th show was also erased when doing so.
ARGH!
I find it amazing that nearly 10 years later HDTV recording remains an infantile exercise of little choice and failing products.
I am happy to report that since the early February software upgrade I've had no lockups, reboots, RBRs, lost or missed or unwatchable recordings. I no longer feel the need for backup recordings on other DVRs. I haven't checked dbstalk recently so there may still be problems but for me at least it's been rock solid. Finally.
Has anyone experienced loud cracking noises? I'm also getting audio dropouts.
I have had the DirecTV HR-20 for a few weeks now and have been reluctant to watch it. I have been having so many problems with the audio that I have pretty much stayed with my old SD Hughes DirecTV Tivo units.
I am experiencing audio dropouts and loud "cracking" noises on the HD channels rendering them practically unwatchable.
I am waiting for a replacement unit and am hoping that I get "lucky" and receive one without any problems.
The DirecTV repair guy said "you just have to replace them until you get a good one".
I currently have 4 Hughes DirecTV Tivo units and this is my first DirecTV DVR.
I had decided to switch my Dish 622 for Direct's HD service. I am certainly glad that I wondered onto this site before I made the commitment. That you all for your candor--I'll be sticking with the 622.
) But their 622 HD DVR is a great product. And, for me, it has the feature that I don't think that I could live without, the 30-second forward skip and 10-second backward skip. Both my previous ReplayTV units had this. I understand that the HR 20 does not have this feature. So, I am locked in to Dish for 18 months and will look and see where DirecTV is at that time. Dish does not currently have my local network channels in HD, but I get them over-the-air pretty well and Dish should have them this year. So, for the intermediate term anyway, I am convinced that II made the right choice (based on my requirements anyway). 
Concerning the problem with the Direct TV DVR