As I write this, the negative/problem posts continue to stack up on <a href="http://www.hdtvmagazine.com/cgi-bin/ntlinktrack.cgi?http://www.dbstalk.com/">DBSTalk.com</a>, a Web forum devoted to satellite TV and its users. Since late summer, that particular forum has been ground zero for a major "debate" of sorts, one that, in essence, separated DIRECTV defenders from detractors (though to be fair, not everyone who posts is firmly on one side or the other).
[url=http://www.hdtvmagazine.com/articles/2007/01/directvs_hr20_-.php]Read the Full Article[/url]
DIRECTV's HR20 - DVR Debate Rages On
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Tom Starner
- New Member
- Posts: 4
- Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2007 12:49 pm
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kredner
- New Member
- Posts: 1
- Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 12:00 pm
I have been a C-Band (big dish) user for 12 years and ReplayTV user for 6 years. The time had come last fall to make the switch to a small dish system. Dish or DirecTV? My home theater guru favors DirecTV over Dish but pointed out all of the problems with the current DirecTV HD DVR plus the fact that the HR20 was then on back order. Since an HD DVR was critical to my watching (I NEVER watch anything live except the PBS news hour), I went with Dish. Dish has short comings for sure (they wouldn't give me Golf Channel ala carte -- it only comes in their most expensive package 
) But their 622 HD DVR is a great product. And, for me, it has the feature that I don't think that I could live without, the 30-second forward skip and 10-second backward skip. Both my previous ReplayTV units had this. I understand that the HR 20 does not have this feature. So, I am locked in to Dish for 18 months and will look and see where DirecTV is at that time. Dish does not currently have my local network channels in HD, but I get them over-the-air pretty well and Dish should have them this year. So, for the intermediate term anyway, I am convinced that II made the right choice (based on my requirements anyway).
) But their 622 HD DVR is a great product. And, for me, it has the feature that I don't think that I could live without, the 30-second forward skip and 10-second backward skip. Both my previous ReplayTV units had this. I understand that the HR 20 does not have this feature. So, I am locked in to Dish for 18 months and will look and see where DirecTV is at that time. Dish does not currently have my local network channels in HD, but I get them over-the-air pretty well and Dish should have them this year. So, for the intermediate term anyway, I am convinced that II made the right choice (based on my requirements anyway).-
dhaakenson
- New Member
- Posts: 1
- Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2007 4:38 am
How long before the HR20 provokes a class action lawsuit?
I've been a loyal DirecTv subscriber since its birth, when it was only available in a couple test market cities. Over the years, I've enjoyed the nearly seamless quality of service and diversity of programming.
With DirecTv's implementation of TiVo, I was overjoyed, because my SD TiVos performed flawlessly. They have NEVER suffered a single problem, and their elegant user interface easily enticed my wife and young daughter. Even the bean shaped remote was a pleasure to hold.
Now, I have an HR20, and can honestly say I've never experienced a more flawed device in my life. How could such a high profile, respected company, facing ever increasing competition, allow a device like this to ever be sold? Surely they knew it was deeply flawed, and if they didn't know before customers did, that's equally damning.
Never has the bloom of excitement and anticipation of a new high end electronics purchase been so abruptly extinguished by the performance of the product.
After convincing my wife that HDTV was the way to go, she also is now entirely satisfied with the SD recordings of our old TiVos. Anything to avoid the endless glitches of the new recorder. Despite software updates (including the most recent "test" version that hasn't been nationally released yet), the device still is unable to record a show free of continual audio and video dropouts. It's so irritating to watch that even I've returned to the old TiVos to record my favorite shows.
Sure, the HR20 DVR is great when it works (ie, isn't recording anything), but for $299 merely for the right to pay a monthly lease for a device DirecTv owns and eventually wants back (even though it only has a 90 day warranty), and a new 2-year commitment to DirecTv that starts when I turn the HR20 on, I'd say my expectation is that the DVR should work fairly consistently or never be sold to me. I'd like to watch TV, not struggle with a recorder. If this were a VCR or something I owned instead of leased, I'd have literally taken a sledgehammer to it already, splattering its guts all over my garage floor.
Some of the early HR20 adopters seem to enjoy the endless tinkering involved with using this device, posting endlessly flatulant reports to various blogs about successful reboots and nuanced improvements from various software revisions.
But there are many more still who simply will dump DirecTv, as I will, and move to Dish, cable or FIOS.
If ever there was a product that cried out for a class action lawsuit, the HR20 is it. Since the device does not work as specified, I see my new 2-year commitment as void. If DirecTv disagrees, perhaps a massive lawsuit is necessary to convince them.
Complaints to DirecTv customer service fall on deaf ears. "Our unit is just like a TiVo," the voice on the phone cheerfully tells me. "Yeah, and I suppose an MP3 player with audio dropouts is just like an iPod," I reply.
With DirecTv's implementation of TiVo, I was overjoyed, because my SD TiVos performed flawlessly. They have NEVER suffered a single problem, and their elegant user interface easily enticed my wife and young daughter. Even the bean shaped remote was a pleasure to hold.
Now, I have an HR20, and can honestly say I've never experienced a more flawed device in my life. How could such a high profile, respected company, facing ever increasing competition, allow a device like this to ever be sold? Surely they knew it was deeply flawed, and if they didn't know before customers did, that's equally damning.
Never has the bloom of excitement and anticipation of a new high end electronics purchase been so abruptly extinguished by the performance of the product.
After convincing my wife that HDTV was the way to go, she also is now entirely satisfied with the SD recordings of our old TiVos. Anything to avoid the endless glitches of the new recorder. Despite software updates (including the most recent "test" version that hasn't been nationally released yet), the device still is unable to record a show free of continual audio and video dropouts. It's so irritating to watch that even I've returned to the old TiVos to record my favorite shows.
Sure, the HR20 DVR is great when it works (ie, isn't recording anything), but for $299 merely for the right to pay a monthly lease for a device DirecTv owns and eventually wants back (even though it only has a 90 day warranty), and a new 2-year commitment to DirecTv that starts when I turn the HR20 on, I'd say my expectation is that the DVR should work fairly consistently or never be sold to me. I'd like to watch TV, not struggle with a recorder. If this were a VCR or something I owned instead of leased, I'd have literally taken a sledgehammer to it already, splattering its guts all over my garage floor.
Some of the early HR20 adopters seem to enjoy the endless tinkering involved with using this device, posting endlessly flatulant reports to various blogs about successful reboots and nuanced improvements from various software revisions.
But there are many more still who simply will dump DirecTv, as I will, and move to Dish, cable or FIOS.
If ever there was a product that cried out for a class action lawsuit, the HR20 is it. Since the device does not work as specified, I see my new 2-year commitment as void. If DirecTv disagrees, perhaps a massive lawsuit is necessary to convince them.
Complaints to DirecTv customer service fall on deaf ears. "Our unit is just like a TiVo," the voice on the phone cheerfully tells me. "Yeah, and I suppose an MP3 player with audio dropouts is just like an iPod," I reply.
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jerfilm
- Major Contributor
- Posts: 82
- Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2004 12:46 pm
I switched........
I was a D*TV subscriber almost from day one. But last summer when we got to our cabin in CO I discovered that the old receiver there wasn't working. Since I wanted to switch to HD there anyway, I did a little research and saw that D*TV was having problems with it's new unit. So I decided to go with Dish - LOTS more HD content - ok, so some of it isn't the greatest - and I could get the local Denver channels in HD as well.
I can't say that I like it better - I record some things like Silent Sunday Nights on TCM manually for 2.5 hours and I liked being able to go directly to the end and step my way backwards to find the end of the movie. Can't seem to do that with the Dish recorder. On the other hand, here was a pleasant bonus, when we got back to MN I cancelled D*TV there and added Dish as an additional receiver. To my amazement, I get the Denver locals there as well - no beaming like D*TV - so if my antenna isn't working the greatest I can switch and watch network stuff from CO. Also, many programs are an hour later in CO - sometimes a bonus too. The flip side is that the program guide is in Mountain Standard Time. Gotta remember to add an hour....... :D
I would think that since D*TV has not delivered what they promised, you might consider cancelling and letting them sue you for what they think you owe them for the balance. Turn it into a class action suit and watch the sparks fly. Plaintiffs seldom win much in class actions, but often the defendent at least loses......frequently enough satisfaction for the winners.....
I can't say that I like it better - I record some things like Silent Sunday Nights on TCM manually for 2.5 hours and I liked being able to go directly to the end and step my way backwards to find the end of the movie. Can't seem to do that with the Dish recorder. On the other hand, here was a pleasant bonus, when we got back to MN I cancelled D*TV there and added Dish as an additional receiver. To my amazement, I get the Denver locals there as well - no beaming like D*TV - so if my antenna isn't working the greatest I can switch and watch network stuff from CO. Also, many programs are an hour later in CO - sometimes a bonus too. The flip side is that the program guide is in Mountain Standard Time. Gotta remember to add an hour....... :D
I would think that since D*TV has not delivered what they promised, you might consider cancelling and letting them sue you for what they think you owe them for the balance. Turn it into a class action suit and watch the sparks fly. Plaintiffs seldom win much in class actions, but often the defendent at least loses......frequently enough satisfaction for the winners.....
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juztfurfun
- New Member
- Posts: 1
- Joined: Sat Aug 19, 2006 5:44 am
I am waiting to buy the HR20
Nice review---i have been following this forum and agree the HR20 is still unofficially in beta testing and you guys are the lab animals----and btw your paying to be experimented on !!!
as for me---i am still using the HR10-250 without hassles om my triple lnb---but like prev experience with microsofts windows------
I plan to upgrade to VISTA and the HR20 january 1 , 2008----maybe !!!
again sorry for your frustrations--i had a minor one with e HR10-250 and HDMI--when it first came out---but luckily the component video worked fine and 2 yrs later thats what i am using
KEEP FIGHTING THOUGH !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
as for me---i am still using the HR10-250 without hassles om my triple lnb---but like prev experience with microsofts windows------
I plan to upgrade to VISTA and the HR20 january 1 , 2008----maybe !!!
again sorry for your frustrations--i had a minor one with e HR10-250 and HDMI--when it first came out---but luckily the component video worked fine and 2 yrs later thats what i am using
KEEP FIGHTING THOUGH !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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tallsweet
- Member
- Posts: 5
- Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2004 6:04 pm
HR20-HD
Boy ,is your article right on. Eight year customer, just "upgraded to HR20 and kept my HR 10 for another TV. Have experienced it all, video and audio drops, the dreaded blank screen, Have lost pay-per-view recordings which really pissed me off. Have several emails and calls into DirecTV, have rebooted entire drive twice, had to reprogram all our shows. Now what, have 30 days left on my warranty. Is it a hardware or software probrlem? Should I demand anothe receiver? They should have made a deal with TIVO and kept the same manufacturers of the HR10-250.
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akirby
- Major Contributor
- Posts: 819
- Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2007 2:52 pm
I've had a few problems but not as many as some. Since I only use this in the home theater to watch a few HD shows each week it's bearable for now, but just barely.
If I was using this to replace my SD DirecTivo upstairs I'd be really pissed.
It's obvious that DirecTV thought they could make DVRs just like Tivo and I think they're in over their head with both hardware and software issues.
They should go crawling back to Tivo and figure out how to get mpeg4 satellite tuners into the series 4 Tivos.
If I was using this to replace my SD DirecTivo upstairs I'd be really pissed.
It's obvious that DirecTV thought they could make DVRs just like Tivo and I think they're in over their head with both hardware and software issues.
They should go crawling back to Tivo and figure out how to get mpeg4 satellite tuners into the series 4 Tivos.
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robertsori
- New Member
- Posts: 2
- Joined: Thu Jan 18, 2007 8:38 am
I agree
I would join in a lawsuit, I don't see why I should have to pay to debug their crap.
They need to be paying me for the lost shows, the failure to function.
I believe some of these, I have had no problem people are DTV plants.
DishNetwork should pay the initial fee's and get us a good lawyer to come after their ass.
They need to be paying me for the lost shows, the failure to function.
I believe some of these, I have had no problem people are DTV plants.
DishNetwork should pay the initial fee's and get us a good lawyer to come after their ass.
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wylie31
- New Member
- Posts: 1
- Joined: Thu Jan 18, 2007 4:41 pm
I was a happy A+ customer for many years with 5 receivers. I have a 5 lnb feed antenna and have enjoyed HD for over a year now.
Then a Christmas I decided to get my wife an HR20 for all the shows she likes to see, but misses. The first HR20 I hooked up started up fine then failed going through its initialization. DirecTV sent out a technician to look at the box. He couldn't get it to turn up either. So after a couple of hours of messing around - a lot of it on hold waiting for DirecTV techs to help. DirecTV decided to send another unit out.
Well 4 days later I get a refurbished unit, unfortunately it is an H20, not an HR20. I call of the number on technical support. They make me go through the entire test procedure again ( a good half hour) and of course it still will not initialize. Then I am put on hold for 30 minutes while someone tries to figure out how to send a new box out. Finally I get an agreement that a new box will be shipped. 4 days later I have another H20 show up on my doorstep.
This time I do not go to the technical depart but demand to speak to a manager. After 45 minutes on hold I give up and decided to call the next day. This time I have success after a mere 20 minutes on hold. This person takes me through technical support and customer support process. 45 minutes later (most of it on hold) DirecTV thinks they can get me an HR20. 4 days later here is the HR20. I hook it up and this unit works for about 5 minutes then up pops a "Does not support this mode" message.
Now I have an h10 and an h20 receiver that have absolutely no problem with my tv or cables ( I even tried switching to the DirecTV hdmi cable to see if it was a resistance problem). This product is just not going to work. I have read horror stories of people trading out 3 or 4 units before getting a working one. It's just not worth it.
So I am going from an extremely satisfied A+ customer to one who is going to cancel his service tomorrow. If this is the type of results that DirecTV considers a huge success, then they are really in serious trouble.
Then a Christmas I decided to get my wife an HR20 for all the shows she likes to see, but misses. The first HR20 I hooked up started up fine then failed going through its initialization. DirecTV sent out a technician to look at the box. He couldn't get it to turn up either. So after a couple of hours of messing around - a lot of it on hold waiting for DirecTV techs to help. DirecTV decided to send another unit out.
Well 4 days later I get a refurbished unit, unfortunately it is an H20, not an HR20. I call of the number on technical support. They make me go through the entire test procedure again ( a good half hour) and of course it still will not initialize. Then I am put on hold for 30 minutes while someone tries to figure out how to send a new box out. Finally I get an agreement that a new box will be shipped. 4 days later I have another H20 show up on my doorstep.
This time I do not go to the technical depart but demand to speak to a manager. After 45 minutes on hold I give up and decided to call the next day. This time I have success after a mere 20 minutes on hold. This person takes me through technical support and customer support process. 45 minutes later (most of it on hold) DirecTV thinks they can get me an HR20. 4 days later here is the HR20. I hook it up and this unit works for about 5 minutes then up pops a "Does not support this mode" message.
Now I have an h10 and an h20 receiver that have absolutely no problem with my tv or cables ( I even tried switching to the DirecTV hdmi cable to see if it was a resistance problem). This product is just not going to work. I have read horror stories of people trading out 3 or 4 units before getting a working one. It's just not worth it.
So I am going from an extremely satisfied A+ customer to one who is going to cancel his service tomorrow. If this is the type of results that DirecTV considers a huge success, then they are really in serious trouble.