1080P-24fps compared to 1080P-60fps?

[mattdr]

1080P-24fps or 1080P-60fps; Which is preferred to veiw & why? (24fps is what theater film is processed in) Is a faster "frame per second" more fluid?

[akirby]

60 fps is the old NTSC standard since 1941. Film is shot at 24 fps. In order to convert a 24 fps dvd to a 60 fps video format you must do "3-2 pulldown" where alternating frames are repeated 3, then 2 times each (12x3 + 12x2 = 60 fps). This can cause artifacts. Therefore 1080p/24 is preferred for film sources so that you avoid the 3-2 pulldown.

Richard will be along shortly with tons of hd library references.......

[mattdr]

It seems the "higher line" HD displays process 1080P-24fps. Is it preferred in watching movies, etc.; being less in conversion & related "artifacts". I know my Panasonic DMP-BD30 Blu-Ray player has a setting for 1080P-24fmp & 1080P-60fps. I found that my Panasonic TH50-PZ77U Plasma HDTV( owned for 9-mo.) will process 1080P-60, but not 1080P-24. I would need to trade up to the Panasonic TH-50PZ800. I am trying to determine if it is worth it or wait for another model year or two.

[eliwhitney]

Hello mattdr --

Totally apart from the film frames/second criteria, that .. 800 .. series IS the sole family currently to actually have a successful, near-perfect menu setting for "Home" rather than "Store Display", resulting in certified THX calibrated colors / shadings / etc..

Also, you now have the most or heaviest filtered unit sold by Panasonic .. that .. 77 .. was / is fantastic for very bright ambient lighting conditions But it also has a tendency to cut down quite significantly on those same shadings / tints and, for some, just seems to be much, much less bright.

Perhaps the current sharp reductions / sales will "tempt" you into an 800 ?

eli

[akirby]

I found that my Panasonic TH50-PZ77U Plasma HDTV( owned for 9-mo.) will process 1080P-60, but not 1080P-24. I would need to trade up to the Panasonic TH-50PZ800. I am trying to determine if it is worth it or wait for another model year or two.

If the only difference is being able to accept 1080p/24 versus 1080p/60 - I doubt that you'd notice the difference and even if you did it's probably not worth upgrading right away. If it was me I'd wait for more features and/or lower prices.

[Richard]

With a native 1920x1080 24 frame display and 1080p 24 frame source the power of 1080p 24 frames is the ability to bypass video processing for the most high fidelity image. This requires a videophile race track and that means you need to be within 3-4 screen heights of the display and use the format/aspect that allows 1:1 pixel mapping to fully experience the benefits.

[Rodolfo]

Unless the display device has the ability to take the inputted 24fps and display it at multiples of it (72Hz like Pioneer Elite, 48/96Hz on some projectors, etc) without any pull-down processing, it becomes a matter of which piece of the video chain is doing better the 3-2 pull-down, the player, the middle boxes, the display, etc.

And that is, having the player/sat receiver a) send an unaltered 24fps to let the display do an uncontrolled pull-down because the display only does 60Hz for example, or b) do the pull-down to 60fps at the source from 24fps content, which the display device shows as 60 or 120Hz, for example.

As long as one of them is doing it without your control, I see no benefit of upgrading a display when you have no control of the pull-down processing for 24fps content.

You better make sure of what a device does with the 24fps before assuming it is better than what you already have.

This article has a section where I touch the subject a bit:

http://www.hdtvmagazine.com/articles/20 ... r_eyes.php

And although this one is almost 3 years old it provides some more information about the subject:

http://www.hdtvmagazine.com/articles/20 ... splays.php

Best Regards,

Rodolfo La Maestra

[mattdr]

Hello mattdr --

Totally apart from the film frames/second criteria, that .. 800 .. series IS the sole family currently to actually have a successful, near-perfect menu setting for "Home" rather than "Store Display", resulting in certified THX calibrated colors / shadings / etc..

Also, you now have the most or heaviest filtered unit sold by Panasonic .. that .. 77 .. was / is fantastic for very bright ambient lighting conditions But it also has a tendency to cut down quite significantly on those same shadings / tints and, for some, just seems to be much, much less bright.

Perhaps the current sharp reductions / sales will "tempt" you into an 800 ?

eli

CNET/David Katzmaier reviewed the Panasonic TH-50PZ800U: gave a Editor's Pick rating @ Excellent 8.7
"we can say with certainty that Panasonic's TH-50PZ800U is a worthy competitor to the Kuro, and in many ways, it performs even better."
"We tested the Panasonic's "24p direct in" mode by setting it to 48Hz and switching our PS3 to 1080p/24 mode. After doing so, the first thing we noticed was significant flicker, which was most obvious in brighter areas of the picture, such as the overcast sky or sun-scorched desert hardpan, but was present throughout. The flicker made the image basically unwatchable, and we much preferred the look of standard 60Hz mode. If it weren't for the flicker, however, the 24p mode would be great, because it did make movement appear more natural, removing the hitching in motion associated with 60Hz's necessary 2:3 pull-down process. We feel most viewers will notice and object to the flicker enough to abandon the 48Hz setting, however."

I am still researching if the 1080p-24fps is great veiwing as it was originally filmed or do you want the processing. I am looking for experienced review.
I got a price of 2099.99 w/ free Panasonic BD35 blu-ray player, no sales tax, from Vann's (12mo.S.as C.); & 2174.00 w/ blu-ray player, w/sales tax (36mo.S.as C.) So, I got some deciding.

[bruceghtva]

This whole business of which is better on which TV and how to set it up has me confused and after some trial and error testing I am no further along on the question of how to best setup my system for optimal performance together. I have the Toshiba HD DVD A-30 with the latest 4.0 software loaded. This HD player has always had the highest resolution setting of "up to 1080P/24fps". I have mine set that way now after going back and forth from 60fps to 24fps having decided that the highest resolution setting offers the most possibilities. My frame rates and video versus film are set to "Auto" in the hope that with these settings I will get the best results without continually self-tweaking.
My Display is a new Panasonic Plasma TH46PZ85U. I could not justify the 85O or the 80O for the additional money even though I know they handle 24fps better. So my question is how do I set this up the best? I've calibrated the TV according to posted settings on another forum until I receive my just ordered "DVE HD DVD Video Essentials" and then I will recalibrate myself. What else can I do to the Panasonic display? What should be the optmal setting for the HD DVD player? Do I need to manually change it for a regular DVD and/or a Video rather than a film? Is Planet Earth a Video or a film? How do you know what setting to use for different materials?
I'd really appreciate some guidance and I find that even though I am an EE the discussions of 3:2 Pulldown I've read don't really summarize what's best to do and where to do it. By that I mean at my display or at my HD DVD player.

[Richard]

mattdr,

If you are looking for performance I suggest getting a calibrator involved. The science works but you need a display that provides it and settings have to be right; unfortunately it is not a one size or setting fits all approach.

http://www.isfforum.com/Find-a-Calibrat ... ators.html

Based on the Cnet review 1080p24 is not the Panasonic