Another Opinion - On the Matter of the HD DVD Petition...

[akirby]

Phil - why won't you answer my question? If one format is bad, then why didn't we hear these same arguments with standard DVDs? Why is it different? Where does the monopoly exist? Certainly not in players - all major mfrs will now be making BR players (that's called competition, BTW).

[pmalter0]

Phil - why won't you answer my question? If one format is bad, then why didn't we hear these same arguments with standard DVDs? Why is it different? Where does the monopoly exist? Certainly not in players - all major mfrs will now be making BR players (that's called competition, BTW).

You didn't ask me--but I'll answer anyway: 1) It took far longer for DVD player prices to fall than HD disc players--why--competition; 2) had there been an alternative medium to DVD, DVD disc prices would have been even lower--why-- competition always produces lower prices than monopoly.

Phil

[terrypaullin]

So I've been holding my breath, expecting to be disappointed once again. (Anyone want my laserdisc collection?). With the Warner Bros., the possibility rears its head that Blu-Ray could win!

Exhale David - the fat lady has sung. Many don't know (except for Phil, of coursel) that the Paramount and Universal deals have escape clauses that let them out if Warner flipped. Warner flipped - it's over. Just like we can find nearly everything put on celluloid now transferred to DVD, you can expect to find "HD-DVD only" movies re-mastered on BD when the the transfer houses get caught up. I personally liked HD-DVD for it's superior user interactivity, menu schemes, etc., but I'm sure you have some valid technical reasons for your BD preference as well. It's all moot now. Enjoy the movies!

[terrypaullin]

Wrong again Terry, we live under a free enterprise system, not a free predation system. And the courts do prevent contracts or conspiracies to restrain trade such as the Warners/Sony deal.

Only the future can really tell, but I believe that you are wrong here too. A monopolized blue ray only industry will not produce players or discs at prices low enough for the mass-market; and ultimately lose out to Internet HD movies. And HD disc media will become a niche market only.

Well, Phil, looks like I'm wrong about most everything. But since you aren't, you might do Sony the favor of dropping them an e-mail. Since they have now spent upwards of a BILLION dollars securing this "monopoly", their legal department should be advised of their mis-step. I'm thinking it probably came up in a board meeting once, but I'm probably wrong about that too.

[akirby]

1) It took far longer for DVD player prices to fall than HD disc players--why--competition

The current "cheap" prices for HD DVD and PS3 players (if you discount the game portion of the PS3) are not due to "competition". These cheap prices are short term bribes to gain market penetration to win the format war. I guarantee you the HD DVD prices will go back to normal once Toshiba accepts that HD DVD won't win, as will Blu-Ray player prices. It's just like those introductory rates you get for cable or satellite to switch providers. Long term the prices will rise, then start to drop as consumers start purchasing and volumes ramp up.

CD and DVD prices were high to begin with, then dropped over time. The same will happen with Blu-Ray, just as it does with every other technology.

2) had there been an alternative medium to DVD, DVD disc prices would have been even lower--why-- competition always produces lower prices than monopoly.

You're ignoring the fact that consumers stopped purchasing ALL DVD formats because of the uncertainty, and that's what drove Warner to side with Sony to break the stalemate.

You're trying to rationalize your personal preferences for HD DVD and cheap/free players and movies by throwing around words like anti-trust, monopoly, competition and class-action lawsuits. Get over it.

[miller]

The current "cheap" prices for HD DVD and PS3 players (if you discount the game portion of the PS3) are not due to "competition". These cheap prices are short term bribes to gain market penetration to win the format war.

Umm ... isn't that called "competition"? If there was no competition, would they need short-term bribes? No. So that's competition.

- Miller

[akirby]

The current "cheap" prices for HD DVD and PS3 players (if you discount the game portion of the PS3) are not due to "competition". These cheap prices are short term bribes to gain market penetration to win the format war.

Umm ... isn't that called "competition"? If there was no competition, would they need short-term bribes? No. So that's competition.

- Miller

It's unsustainable. No company can afford to basically give away players and movies for very long. How much do you think Toshiba loses every time they sell a player and 5 movies for $150? And how long do you think companies can stay in business losing money like that?

It's no different than Wendy's offering 50 cent sandwiches and 5 free Frostys in an attempt to gain marketshare from McDonalds and Burger King. It works for a few days or weeks but after a year they'd be out of business.

True competition forces companies to constantly lower their cost structures and add features to keep or gain market share.

[miller]

It's no different than Wendy's offering 50 cent sandwiches and 5 free Frostys in an attempt to gain marketshare from McDonalds and Burger King. It works for a few days or weeks but after a year they'd be out of business.

http://www.answers.com/competition

Check out definition 3 and tell me again how what you're describing isn't competition.

Case closed.

- Miller

[akirby]

Pay attention. I said it was unsustainable. Toshiba could not afford to keep giving away players and 5 movies for $150 regardless of what happens with the format war. It's a short term perk for early adopters, that's all.

Or do you somehow believe that a company can stay in business by continually losing money?

[miller]

Pay attention. I said it was unsustainable.

I am paying attention ...

The current "cheap" prices for HD DVD and PS3 players (if you discount the game portion of the PS3) are not due to "competition".

I'm not arguing that it's sustainable, I agree with you on that ... but just because a low price is unsustainable does not mean it isn't due to competition.

Just accept that you were mistaken and let's move on.

- Miller